Polemarchus has thus handed over the logoi to Cephalus, and now, he wants them back. Although I am not sympathetic to the idea that just persons never harm anyone, given the usual notion of 'harm' e. Rowman and Littlefield, Therefore, a just man lives happy.
Socrates proceeds penultimately, to discuss democracy. Physical education should be geared to benefit the soul rather than the body, since the body necessarily benefits when the soul is in a good condition, whereas the soul does not necessarily benefit when the body is in a good condition b-c.
Cephalus, a rich, well-respected elder of the city, and host to the group, is the first to offer a definition of justice. Obviously, there can be and are exceptions.
The only truly fulfilling pleasure is that which comes from understanding since the objects it pursues are permanent b-c. The bottom line here however is that Irwin seems to me to have made a bad and unnecessarily sophisticated case for a correct claim, viz.
And it is only when Socrates starts asking about the past in fact looking for "the greatest good ti megiston agathon " d in the past! As such, it ought to be kept in mind that Socrates, in the elenchus, is out to defend his belief that no human knows what X is in his fussy sense of "know".
At the very least, Irwin should allow that such a claim is in need of clarification concerning the boundaries and scope of human happiness. So anyone who has doubts about this assumption will, and ought, to have doubts about the claim that just people always make others more just.
Thrasymachus who represented the new and critical view, propounded the radical theory of justice. Discussion between Socrates and Thrasymachus follows bc.
The conversation focuses on justice but actually must be viewed in the context of how each individual can lead the best life possible.
There are also elements of fascism or totalitarianism. But if Polemarchus did accept the assumption as Annas claims which I don't think he does, for the assumption seems too strong to be identified with any parts of Socrates' argumentit would be irrelevant whether Socrates had provided any support for it.
I do not see Socrates "concluding" that it cannot be just to harm the bad. Some there are who would regard murdering Hitler as just.
For if one holds that Socrates' claim is legitimate, the conclusion that harming enemies cannot be part of justice cannot be avoided. Worse yet, it is obvious that Socrates himself is here leaning on ideas that he does not accept.
Socrates criticises the defination of justice given by Thrasymachus and he says just as a physician studies and exercises his power not in his interest but in the interest of a patient, the Government of any kind shall do what is good for the people for whom it exercises its art.
In this reading, Cephalus, "head", stands at the level of the higher part of the soul, the logos, while Polemarchus, "principle of fight", stands at the level of the intermediate part of the soul, the thumos. Socrates notes that in many associations with others, it is a particular sort of expert that is helpful; a checkers player in a game of checkers, a builder when bricks and stone are to be put together, a musician in matters of music, etc.
Once the main argument of the Republic is finished end of Book IXone can return to Book I and appreciate just how much it anticipated and hinted at what was to follow. In democracy most of the political offices are distributed by lot a.After Cephalus and Socrates agree that truth-telling and paying back debts is not a proper definition of justice, Polemarchus jumps in for his father and says that it is a proper definition, if, that is, the poet Simonides is to be believed.
Way (1/3) that socrates probes and criticizes. no just person would willingly want to make someone worse. 6 Polemarchus defines justice as ‘helping one’s friends and harming one’s enemies.’ Way (2/3) that socrates probes and criticizes%(4).
Justice therefore, is not the advantage of the stronger, it is rather the advantage of all. Because Socrates thinks an ideal ruler in a city thinks for the benefit for his subjects, his view of justice is very far apart from Thrasymachus, as he feels that justice will benefit people who are both weak and strong.
What is Aristotle’s view of the relation between experience and virtue? Cephalus’s definition of morality/justice Speaking the truth and paying your debts Socrates rejects Cephalus’s statement because is not universal and generalizable, therefore incorrect. Cephalus who was a representative of traditional morality of the ancient trading class established the traditional theory of justice.
According to him 'justice consists in speaking the truth and paying one's debt. Plato's Republic Justice is a word that can be defined in many different ways. Everyone has the right to define justice however they want because its' their opinion and everyone has the right to an opinion.
One may think that justice is simple to define, but in reality, what is justice?